From Corporate to CEO: Margot Nash’s Journey to Mindmetrix

[00:00:00] Hello and welcome to The Balancing Act, the show that dives into real stories of people I admire who are balancing the challenges of navigating a high level career while raising a family. I’m your host, Sarah Sheridan, Director of Sales and Executive Recruiting at Hirewell and mom to three little ones.

[00:00:20] Super excited to welcome our guest today, Margot Nash. Margot and I got to work together back at the Mom Project, and since then, she has co founded and is CEO of MindMetrix, and has two little ones. Margot, welcome! Thank you so much! Thank you so much for having me, Sarah! Thank you for being here! I know we just caught up, and it had been a while.

[00:00:45] It didn’t feel like it, but I feel like a lot of life has happened. Yep. You had your second kid. You founded a company. I had two more. Yes, it has been. It almost feels like a lifetime since then, although it has not been [00:01:00] that long ago. Right, right. Yeah. Things have been happening, which is good. Yes. Well, Margot, just to kick things off, would love to just do a quick intro.

[00:01:11] You know, if you can tell us a little bit more about yourself, your career journey, the company you just launched, and then your family life. Yeah. So, there’s a lot in there. I am, as you said, most importantly, a mom of two little ones. So, I have a, a eight year old son and a two year old daughter. And, We share their names because I love them.

[00:01:35] Yep. So, my son, Levi, and my daughter, Carmen. They are wonderful. They are wild. And, it’s a time in mornings lately. I am, the lucky to be in a job that I love. I am the CEO of a company called MindMetrix, which is a mental health assessment company, which I can tell you a little bit [00:02:00] about, but I think, my career path has been one that’s maybe a little bit less traditional.

[00:02:06] I don’t know if we’ve ever talked about kind of how I got started, but, no, I mean, so, so I’ll, I’ll get into that and I can, I know, I know we’re going to talk about, you know, balancing, you know, kind of this wild, time really in my children’s lives with a career, but, lots to, lots to talk about there, but to start, I actually got.

[00:02:32] Yeah. into, the world of mental health and kind of a roundabout way. My, I’ve always been like really drawn to careers and jobs where I’m, you know, kind of working to get a better understanding of people and I’ve always been really fascinated by, people and assessments and. Probably, if I, if I kind of like really reflect on it, it’s probably an attempt to get a better understanding of myself.

[00:02:59] I [00:03:00] think everybody kind of has that desire. But I actually started out in, selling makeup at Estee Lauder and, I got a, personality assessment. So they did kind of like a team strengths finders kind of thing. And that got me into this like world of, okay, how can I, you know, if you can use a tool to kind of better understand yourself and understand the people around you, that got me into organizational psychology, which ultimately led me to technology, and building tools that helped companies identify talent, and that took me through a series of startups and launching products around, helping kind of identify fit for certain roles and, And then ultimately led me into the corporate world, which got me to realize that I really wanted to start my own thing.

[00:03:53] So you’ve been kind of on the product side of the house, and a leader in that space when you were corporate. [00:04:00] Exactly. So I led product team. I led the product team at the mom project, and also led product teams, at a company called Hierology and, was also at Grubhub for a period of time. Okay.

[00:04:15] Awesome. I love that. And I love the makeup foundation too. I did not know that. Yes, it was. I really credit my, my kind of roundabout journey to eyeshadow. Love it. Love it. Well, awesome. Thank you for that intro. And I know it’s hard to condense an entire life into like a two minute spiel. so let’s talk more about your current company.

[00:04:38] You know, it sounds like being in like startup world. You kind of always realize you may want to go out on your own. So I feel like a lot of women, especially working moms, we’re kind of seeing a trend of them leaving corporate, you know, doing consulting or launching their own company. So can you kind of walk us through, like once you realize I’m going to launch this [00:05:00] company, what were kind of the first steps you took to make that happen?

[00:05:05] Yeah. So I, a couple of things, I think, I say this kind of half jokingly, but therapy. I think that’s a really good first step. So frankly, I think that was what, you know, I’m a really big believer, obviously, in the mental health space. And I think that getting, you know, a great understanding of kind of where you’re coming from and what your needs are is ultimately look like what helped me realize that I needed to kind of do something on my own.

[00:05:30] I needed that flexibility in my life. I needed to kind of have control, not only of my day, but also of like the work that I was doing. And I think I was at a period of time where I felt like, I was actually trying to have, I was trying to have Carmen, and, we went through, you know, several setbacks in that process and had some, like some losses along the way, and it was like a real journey, and I think probably losing control in that area of my life, contributed to me feeling like I wanted to have [00:06:00] More control at work.

[00:06:02]  And so ultimately, you know, through the therapeutic process, probably realized that, you know, having much more of a say in my day and the things that I’m working on, was really, really important. But then in terms of, like, actually getting started. I love you sharing that because I feel like it’s not really talked about, but there is so much that goes on in family planning and, and losses and all of that on top of being in like a pretty high pressure corporate career where you kind of sometimes feel like you have to hide that.

[00:06:34] So it’s, it’s refreshing to kind of hear that that was a big part of like what motivated you to kind of go out on your own. Yeah, I think it’s kind of a weird thing that so many people go through and, like, people don’t talk about, either because it’s not, You know, acceptable to talk about, in certain environments or because, you know, there’s like a lot of shame and kind of stigma, I think still, you know, associated [00:07:00] with, having, you know, challenges with infertility and things like that.

[00:07:03] But I’m a real big believer in kind of sharing these challenges that kind of what you bring to, to light, helps other people feel a little bit more normal in their situation. And so, I definitely think companies today are getting better. I think about supporting parents through that kind of, that kind of scenario.

[00:07:21] And I, you know, I was fortunate to be in a place that probably would have been supportive, but I still, even amidst that felt like. Very ready to be on my own and, you know, kind of seeing what I could, what I could do, creating my own circumstances for sure. Sure. So then once you like had that idea, you’re like, I’m doing this husband’s on board.

[00:07:42] Why? What would you say were like a couple of the first major steps you took to kind of get this thing launched? Yeah. Yeah. So I will say I can’t take full credit for like having the idea. I, Steps for getting, you know, a business launched. [00:08:00] I will get to. So we, I actually was like really, really fortunate to be connected with Dr. Young, who is a psychiatrist out of, Rochester Hills, Michigan. And, he has a large practice. And, I got to chatting with him about it. What he sees every day in practice. And he told me, he was like, Margot, it’s unbelievable.

[00:08:22] About half of the people who come in to see me about half of my patients have been misdiagnosed before they get here. And they’re struggling about half, which is wild. And that was like. shocking to me and like really eye opening. And he said, you know, for the most part, people have been struggling for a really long time.

[00:08:40] And part of that could be that, you know, he’s built a center that’s kind of known at this point for being the place that you go when, you know, you’re kind of like at the end of the line, like you need to figure out what’s what’s going on. I shouldn’t say that, you know, they have a wide range of patients there, but they do have this reputation for kind of like really being precise with [00:09:00] diagnostics.

[00:09:00] And so He told me this and it was like, oh my god, that’s, that’s really wild. And so what are you doing to do things differently? And he said he’s got this very, you know, sophisticated process that they follow to have all their clinicians, they’ve got about a hundred and some clinicians there, to really use data to inform diagnosis, which, wild as it may seem in mental health, really does not happen across the board.

[00:09:30] If you see a psychiatrist, for the most part, they may be using like one or two rating scales, like probably when you’ve been to the doctor. If you’ve taken like a PHQ 9, you’ll, you’ll, you know, you’ll go in and they’ll ask you, you know, over the last 2 weeks how often have you, yeah, exactly. So, maybe you’ll do a couple of those, but nothing really comprehensive.

[00:09:53] So he kind of built this unique process and we decided together, this was something that like really was a need [00:10:00] out there and that we could actually build something, build a product that could kind of take their process and make it usable by both individuals and practices. And so, so I think first step is really making sure that you have like a really good concept.

[00:10:14]  And so like a real life problem, right? Exactly. And I think I do think a lot of people go into it now, having been in the product world for a while. It’s really easy to get, like, really excited about new technology and about like, like, kind of like fancy ways to do X, Y, Z. But I think a lot of businesses start and they don’t really validate that there’s a real problem that needs to be solved.

[00:10:36] And so that I think is kind of the hardest and like most easy step to miss, when starting something new. So I would definitely say making sure that there’s something out there. I mean, we did a lot to, to kind of validate that. Yes. Other people would really like to use data in their practice or would really like to, in their own life, you know, have a better understanding of what’s going on with their mental health so they could take something to a provider.

[00:10:58] Yeah. To get a more clear picture. [00:11:00] So,  I definitely think, you know, hardest part of starting something new, just validating that there’s something there. Right. And then from there talking to a lot of people. Both to help you kind of like point out blind spots and, you know, also to help potentially fill in the gaps when you need to hire and find people who, do things better than you in certain areas.

[00:11:26] For sure. So it’s kind of like researching, coming up with almost like a simple idea, but that has a need. And then you’re like, have the conversations and then kind of start building your team experts where you’re not an expert. I’m sure. And I mean, there’s no right way to do this. And there’s like a million different kinds of businesses, right?

[00:11:47] Somebody, you know, I know a lot of, my friends have gone off and started like consulting and, I think. You know, that’s kind of a more common path I’m seeing from the corporate world, and I think it’s a little bit [00:12:00] different. But I think for every business, it’s probably there’s some degree of like, Okay, what can I bring that maybe somebody else can’t?

[00:12:05] Or what can I bring to the world that where there is like a real need? Yeah, yeah. I think that’s often kind of the hardest step and really figuring out how to kind of position yourself for sure. For people might need it. And for working moms or just anyone who’s kind of on the fence, they’ve been in the corporate world and they’re thinking about doing this, but it just kind of seems so overwhelming, like, can you share maybe like a surprising thing in the journey, which is more positive and new.

[00:12:36] Where you were like, Oh my gosh, I didn’t realize that would kind of fall into place. And it did. And I may have like underestimated myself to be able to do this. Yeah, I definitely, I mean, like I, you know, I’ve not, I’m a first time CEO and I have, you know, had a lot of experience in the product and technology world, but not in the

[00:12:56]  you know, doing all the things worlds and I think it has [00:13:00] been a really, pleasant surprise to me to, challenge myself to do things that I really have not done, building a financial plan for the business and, talking with, you know, talking with and kind of selling a board on what finances we need for X, Y, Z.

[00:13:16]  that’s something that I really never thought I would do. And I think because. I’m doing something that I really thought I would not be doing. It just makes it a little bit more. I’m more proud of those things that like, I really just didn’t know I kind of had in me. Same for sales. Like, you know, as a founder, you end up doing all the things right.

[00:13:34] And I, I actually used, I used to be like really, really shy as a kid. And I never, you know, even in more recent jobs. I never really thought that I would love doing sales. And as a founder, you end up doing a lot of sales, a lot of selling, you know, you’re talking to every day, you need to kind of buy into you and buy into this concept.

[00:13:55] And, I have found that I, I really love it. Like I’m really [00:14:00] proud, of myself because that’s something that, you know, an area that I’ve really needed to, push myself, but it’s also been shocking to me that it’s kind of fun when you’re selling something that you like really wholeheartedly believe in so much that is like a real passion of yours.

[00:14:15] So that’s been a big surprise for me. No, that makes sense, though. And then what about on the other side? Like, what if you had a chance to kind of go back and start from scratch? What is like one thing you may have done differently? I think So, like, career, like, work wise, I really do think, while therapy is helpful in this arena, I think, as, as women, a lot of times, we’re kind of, like, taught to defer to other people’s perspectives, and so I do think trusting myself is helpful

[00:14:56] more in getting started. And even in like early [00:15:00] kind of conversations about, product direction and things like that. I think, a lot of times I have the answers that I don’t think I have. And it’s taken a lot of, it’s taken experience for me to learn that I actually do know, In many cases, I kind of will like default to, doing lots of research or sourcing opinions or, and I really do have more of that.

[00:15:22]  I kind of know more than I think I do. So I think kind of starting with that confidence is something I wish I could do. On the other hand, I don’t regret anything. I think that, you know, I’ve learned so much from every experience that I’ve had and every mistake, lots of mistakes. That I’ve made along the way.

[00:15:37] That’s awesome. Well, I want to switch gears a little bit. So now that we’ve got kind of background and your company, how you got there. I know you mentioned your husband works full time, you know, long hours, even travel sometimes. Yes. So walk us through, you’re a CEO, he works long hours. How do you guys manage the [00:16:00] house while maintaining these high level careers?

[00:16:03] And what does childcare look like for you? Yeah. So in some ways, I think it’s kind of funny. I’m being asked this because like, I don’t think anybody would. I know I mentioned this to you. I don’t, I really don’t think in my life. I’ve never been called like neat or organized. Like, our house is a little bit like, you know, all over the place.

[00:16:21] So, I guess. I will say it’s true. We both are working a lot. I think a lot of it and like a lot of like what keeps me at peace is just kind of accepting that, like something’s going to go to, you know, go to crap. Like something’s going to either the, house either the you know, either their clothes or either, you know, it’s just it.

[00:16:44] I think we need to have some level of like acceptance that like, it is just really hard. It’s hard to balance, a demanding career with being a parent. So giving myself grace is something that I’m continuously, like, working on. I so second that. I just, [00:17:00] my coming back from this leave. You know, you always want to hit the ground running and be like, I’m going to come back better than ever first week back St. Louis got this random snowstorm. We never got shut down school. So we got three kids. It has been works So that week was You know, scratch that. And then the second week we got hit with that infamous stomach flu going on. And so I, I so agree with you. It’s just, you have to like accept it’s, it’s not gonna ever be what almost you want it to be.

[00:17:33] It’s never going to be perfect and you have to give yourself grace. Yes, exactly. And having, you know. I do think that having flexibility, like you’re saying, like, at work, having grace, you know, you can have grace for yourself, but then if work doesn’t have grace, that’s also really hard. And so I think being in a place that, you know, does afford that it’s like extremely, [00:18:00] extremely grateful for that. And I’m like very aware of that privilege and I feel very, very lucky. But oh my gosh, the flu. Oh my gosh. I do have, such nightmares, but, but how do we make it work? I, I was kind of thinking before our call today, are there tips, are there like actual tips?

[00:18:18] we, we started, so my, my husband, Jeff, he does,  travel a lot now. He didn’t used to. And so like our, demands kind of shifted a little bit. He actually used to have a job where he could take a little bit more time, help with pickup even sometimes. And, that has changed in the last year or two, and we’ve kind of had to like, renegotiate our things that we take care of in the house.

[00:18:44] And, so when he travels, my latest trick is, I don’t know if your kids are like this in the morning, but like mornings are really hard. like they’re really, really like, awful. Yes. Like, it’s just a, like if somebody [00:19:00] witnessed, I don’t know, but,  what I do, so Carmen, our 2-year-old, like hates getting dressed.

[00:19:05] And so one thing that I do now is, do you do this too? I, I get her dressed in her outfit for the next day, the night before. And it’s kind of gross probably. Oh, oh, so you put her to bed in that outfit? I do, I do. . Oh, I kind of love that. because I thought I was ahead of the game by having them pick out, oh no.

[00:19:25] I pick out the 2-year-old, but the four year old’s like very into styling herself now. Okay. It would take like an hour. So we do it the night before, which saves time, but I kind of love where you’re going. I mean, listen, like you do what works. Sometimes it’s the picking out that helps.

[00:19:42] You just got to like, know your kid. Right. But ours. Yeah, we just, I love that actually it’s made mornings like a million times easier. And then, you know, I think it is just like a lot of communication about like, who’s going to be doing what and when, and we kind [00:20:00] of have like settled into, Jeff helps a lot

[00:20:02] more in the mornings. I’m not a morning person either. And he’s able to like, kind of get up and be there. And I kind of run the nighttime routine a little bit more. And it’s just, it is, it is busy. And then, you know, we’re also like really fortunate to, have, good friends who are neighbors, who will help out with, like, we do a lot of like carpooling back and forth to daycare school and that kind of thing.

[00:20:22] Yeah. Yeah. Well, that was the other thing I was going to bring up. I know that, okay. You guys are in Chicago, you don’t have immediate family there, where the reason we’re in St. Louis is we’re a 10 minute drive from my parents, which we, I mean, literally, I kid you not, on a weekly basis. They are helping out with child care. So I was going to ask, like, where do you guys lean in, what is your village, but that’s great.

[00:20:46] You guys have, are they neighbors, like on the block where you guys can just kind of, yes, knock on the door type relationship, we’re, we’re very lucky. And I think, you know, Being in Chicago, [00:21:00] without family, you know, really nearby, we did kind of like lean heavily into the close friendships that we have and we live like we’re very, very lucky we live like A couple houses down from our really good friends and so, yeah, it’s like kind of a knock on the door situation and we do have it arranged.

[00:21:21] We’re like, we’ll text in the morning being like, all right, we’ll do a drop off today. You guys can you do it tomorrow? Jeff’s out of town. Like, it’s kind of a, a good, a good set up there. We’re very lucky. And then I also am really lucky to have like I probably don’t take advantage of this enough but I have like a group of Moms who go to my son’s kids go to my son’s school and they’re all just like very willing to help with drop offs for birthdays and things like that And it’s you know, but it’s hard.

[00:21:48] It’s like without family nearby You kind of create your own little family exactly exactly work hard to kind of You know, figure out what’s going to work and you find that people are [00:22:00] more like what’s been surprising to me as people are much more willing to help than, I would have thought. And, it’s just, it kind of takes a lot for me to like ask for, you know, out of the blue, like a ride, you know, to somewhere, but usually people.

[00:22:14] Same boat as you. Yes. Me too. Yes, like one time we had we have next door neighbors who adore the girls and we were both traveling for work and completely just slipped through the cracks. There was no one to pick the girls up from school. I was, you know, super embarrassed to reach out and this ask and immediately like, of course, that sounds like lovely figured out the car seat situation.

[00:22:38] But I I so agree with you. People want to help. They typically, you know, the kids are fun for them for a couple hours and it’s just like asking for the help. Exactly. Exactly. And I think kind of the same goes, interestingly, for work. I’m really I love that. I’m going to ask for parallels, so Well, I do think that it’s true.

[00:22:59] Like, I [00:23:00] really don’t, I’m so lucky. I have such, I have an amazing team. I, you know, have mentioned before, like, listen, this is going to be a week where it’s going to be challenging for me. Jeff’s out of town. This one’s sick. I’ve got to do X, Y, Z. And my team will step up and be like, how can we help?

[00:23:16] And it’s just really amazing. I feel really, I feel really fortunate to work with people who kind of have each other’s backs in that way. And it’s just always for some reason, like a little bit surprising to me. I’m kind of like shocked when that happens. I don’t know why I totally agree. And I feel like even I mean, I’m in corporate, but my manager is so amazing.

[00:23:34] And it’s never you never even have to give an explanation. Yeah. She’s like, of course, what can I do? I just put it on her calendar. There’s no questions. There’s no, I think she already understands. I feel all the guilt and she like, trust me that I will get the work done and I feel like you have to be in that kind of set up if you are able to

[00:23:56] maintain both things. Yes. Or I think you would [00:24:00] just fail. Ultimately, I think so too. And I do think along those lines, like working in a place where there are, a lot of moms, frankly, yeah, you know, we’re working parents, I think can lead to, you know, a lot of understanding. I agree. I agree at working parents on a leadership board, I think truly trickles down. Yes. I agree more. Awesome. Well, again, I think this was so fun. I feel like we got to hear your journey of both kind of working in startups, how you launched your company. You know, quick question, just because you do have such a interesting background, like coming from corporate, especially startups, which is its own animal.

[00:24:46] I worked for one once. I will never again. But I it’s it’s great experience. But now that you’re like a CEO, co founder, how would you compare balancing again? You’ve got two young [00:25:00] kids, how I’m sure there’s pros and cons, but like, how would you compare experiences owning something versus being an employee, let’s say at a startup?

[00:25:10] Yeah, I think, you know, while my responsibilities are bigger, like if this business doesn’t work out, it’s on me, if the, there’s a lot that’s on me, if we can’t,  figure out how to. You know, grow that’s on me. If we can’t get the product, it’s really like it is a lot of, of, responsibility.

[00:25:29] but I think, and hours, but I think with that, for me, just having the flexibility over my day and over my priorities over the company’s priorities, to me, that feels more free and more flexible than a job where I may be even working less hours, but I don’t get to, you know, have a say in the things that I’m, you know, kind of doing.

[00:25:54] Yeah. Yeah. So, for me, I feel very fortunate to feel [00:26:00] very,  free. And part of that also is working with co-founders who have the same kind of,  who value also a life outside of, work.

[00:26:08] I feel like I’m able to juggle and like be more present for my family when I am happy at work and whatever that means,  Totally agree with you it looks different for everybody.

[00:26:19] But I really to me, I feel it feels very fortunate to be able to, be in this capacity. Well, I’m, I’m just so excited for you. I feel like you’re right. It’s hard to follow your gut and you’ve launched something. It’s, you know, missions in line with what you believe in and you’ve got two little ones. So, you know, your plate is full, but it sounds like you’re, you’re loving it. I am.

[00:26:46] I feel very grateful. And thank you so much again for giving me the opportunity to share that and I just, I appreciate it. Yes. No, thank you so much for your time [00:27:00] and thank you all for joining us. Please tune in next time for more insights on how to balance career and family. I’m Sarah Sheridan, director of sales and recruiting.

[00:27:11] And if you have any hiring needs, please contact me at the link below. Thanks.